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Saturday, May 25th, 2013
Volume ∞ Issue ∞
- 5:36:49, May 15th 2013 - Frank Hawthorne - Though I hated to see you reference Glenn Beck by name [Three Times ... [Read More]
- 11:42:07, May 10th 2013 - yenken - I feel very sorry for those who have commented do far, as when you stand fa ... [Read More]
- 12:10:25, Apr 26th 2013 - Frank Hawthorne - Mr. "Cabtrom's" garbage-out[burst]--in response to Ms. Reisner's w ... [Read More]
- 9:51:50, Apr 24th 2013 - jeff pischke - To Jerry Grehl, the number to the fillmore county sheriffs office is 7 ... [Read More]
- 9:27:24, Apr 22nd 2013 - Cabtrom - Blah blah blah, garbage in garbage out! ... [Read More]
- 7:00:49, Apr 11th 2013 - Donald Pierce - Col. Stan Gudmundson hit most of the important nails squarly on the h ... [Read More]
- 12:44:54, Apr 4th 2013 - Frank Hawthorne - My compliments to Ms. Hammer for giving us well-crafted "Rachel Rea ... [Read More]
- 5:09:06, Apr 3rd 2013 - truthiness - I see this is dated April 1. That explains it! ... [Read More]
- 12:04:33, Apr 3rd 2013 - Frank W. Hawthorne - Say WHAT?!? Stan's American-Pie [In SKY] is Falling--Not Again? ... [Read More]
- 12:40:21, Mar 29th 2013 - Jacob - It's a shame that so few people care about making their voices heard. If we ... [Read More]
Advance the gun debate
Mon, Jan 21st, 2013
Posted in Commentary
Posted in Commentary
Comments(2)
I had planned a commentary on New Year’s Resolutions, which I assure you would have been witty and thought-provoking. I had looked forward to exploring some lighter issues now that we were through an election year.
But December 14 we watched as news unfolded from Newtown, CT of 27 dead. It was shocking for occurring in what is usually a season of peace, and at a school. Shocking, but unexpected? If we are honest, we should have known this would happen at some point.
Happen again at some point. Remember Columbine? Red Lake? There have been at least eight school shootings with multiple fatalities in the last decade, including two in Minnesota. Overall, we average a shooting with multiple fatalities every 5.9 days! And that’s not counting individual shootings; in 2012 there were almost 30,000 gun deaths – about 12,000 of them murders. No other country with a functioning government even comes close, not even per capita.
That should horrify us. Yes, there are shootings in self-defense and by law enforcement, but they are all shootings. Highway deaths were at alarming levels: we enacted tougher laws against drunk driving and erected speed limit signs and guardrails. Seven people died from poisoned Tylenol and we began requiring sealed bottles. But we do little about gun violence. Already one senses the urgency fading (Hey! Oscar nominations are out!) and sides being drawn up to dig in for a fight.
We need to discuss how to address gun violence, rationally but NOW. We can’t do as some are saying yet again, wait until things quiet down. THEY NEVER QUIET DOWN. Every 5.9 days, multiple fatalities. 30,000 gun deaths a year.
“Discuss” has to mean a genuine debate, and by that I mean the discussion advances the debate. It’s not enough to recycle and repeat the same arguments, louder. We cannot afford one side repeating “guns are evil,” the other claiming a right to have whatever they want.
I am a gun owner, bird hunter and trap shooter; I don’t believe guns themselves are evil. Guns are sporting goods – some guns, anyway. Guns have been essential tools in defending our country and our neighborhoods.
That said, what was essential to win World War II is not essential for me to have at home. As George H.W. Bush expressed when he resigned from the NRA in the 1990s, the way to be a responsible gun owner is to be reasonable, not militant.
The Second Amendment was never intended to apply universally to individual, unrestricted ownership. Obviously: we have gun control laws. The first time the Supreme Court ever struck down a law based on the Amendment was in 2008, and that was on a sweeping handgun ban. Registration, background checks and some training requirements have all been upheld in the courts. The Constitutionality issue is overplayed.
There is room for debate, no matter what the extremes tell us. Remember what is at stake: lives are being lost. We can’t be distracted because of a few loud voices.
We should require registration. We are required to register our cars and our dogs, but not our firearms? Is the fear of universal confiscation any more than a fringe argument, usually invoking Hitler?
Some arms and accessories don’t belong in private hands. The rapid-firing weapons and large clips used in many shootings don’t have a purpose that outweighs the risk. We already have a line here; let’s just redraw it with a bold marker.
Laws should be uniform. The argument that gun control laws do not work is not valid when someone can travel a few miles and find a different set of laws. And there are loopholes all over the place: at some gun shows, for example.
We need to make effective mental health care more available. The Newtown shooter had seen a therapist – it won’t prevent all fatalities – but it will help. It will help reduce all killings.
We need to be more effective as parents and/or adults. We need to lock up firearms and get more involved in children’s lives and decisions. We need to be more spiritual and less material.
We do not need to introduce guns everywhere as a deterrent or defense. More guns seem to promote more guns, no matter whose hands they’re in. And they don’t always stay in those hands.
We need to hold lawmakers accountable. In the last couple of years Congress has slipped amendments into unrelated bills that exempted dealers from verification of stolen guns, exempted veterans from certain background checks based on mental health, etc. We’ve seen politicians exploit the fear of guns to the extreme as well, alienating many who would accept rational measures. Lawmakers seem to be more accountable to campaign contributions and passionate blocs than to those they represent.
Consider that in the 2012 Aurora, CO massacre, for example, the shooter fired 30 rounds in under 30 seconds. 200 years ago a good shooter could maybe fire 30 rounds in an hour and a half. The men who adopted the Second Amendment had no knowledge of where we would be today, nor should we expect them to have been omniscient.
The Founding Fathers didn’t give everyone the right to vote, let slavery persist, never accounted for lawmakers acting in their own interest, etc. We have amended the Constitution and our thinking since then. Clinging to an unfettered right to ownership of all weapons shouldn’t stop us from working with this.
As a rural 1960s Minnesota boy with a crew cut, wearing a flannel shirt and Red Wing boots, I took a handgun to school. Another kid and I brought them for show-n-tell, waving them around in front of the class. It was not a big deal then, we just kept them in our coats the rest of the day. No one thought twice.
But times change, and we have to change. Can we really just let the carnage continue? There has to be a middle ground between a police state and a Wild West atmosphere.
Let’s not let the debate lose momentum, but let’s be civil, reasonable and respectful at the same time. Sift through the arguments and reject the distractions. A good share of 30,000 lives per year depends on it.
But December 14 we watched as news unfolded from Newtown, CT of 27 dead. It was shocking for occurring in what is usually a season of peace, and at a school. Shocking, but unexpected? If we are honest, we should have known this would happen at some point.
Happen again at some point. Remember Columbine? Red Lake? There have been at least eight school shootings with multiple fatalities in the last decade, including two in Minnesota. Overall, we average a shooting with multiple fatalities every 5.9 days! And that’s not counting individual shootings; in 2012 there were almost 30,000 gun deaths – about 12,000 of them murders. No other country with a functioning government even comes close, not even per capita.
That should horrify us. Yes, there are shootings in self-defense and by law enforcement, but they are all shootings. Highway deaths were at alarming levels: we enacted tougher laws against drunk driving and erected speed limit signs and guardrails. Seven people died from poisoned Tylenol and we began requiring sealed bottles. But we do little about gun violence. Already one senses the urgency fading (Hey! Oscar nominations are out!) and sides being drawn up to dig in for a fight.
We need to discuss how to address gun violence, rationally but NOW. We can’t do as some are saying yet again, wait until things quiet down. THEY NEVER QUIET DOWN. Every 5.9 days, multiple fatalities. 30,000 gun deaths a year.
“Discuss” has to mean a genuine debate, and by that I mean the discussion advances the debate. It’s not enough to recycle and repeat the same arguments, louder. We cannot afford one side repeating “guns are evil,” the other claiming a right to have whatever they want.
I am a gun owner, bird hunter and trap shooter; I don’t believe guns themselves are evil. Guns are sporting goods – some guns, anyway. Guns have been essential tools in defending our country and our neighborhoods.
That said, what was essential to win World War II is not essential for me to have at home. As George H.W. Bush expressed when he resigned from the NRA in the 1990s, the way to be a responsible gun owner is to be reasonable, not militant.
The Second Amendment was never intended to apply universally to individual, unrestricted ownership. Obviously: we have gun control laws. The first time the Supreme Court ever struck down a law based on the Amendment was in 2008, and that was on a sweeping handgun ban. Registration, background checks and some training requirements have all been upheld in the courts. The Constitutionality issue is overplayed.
There is room for debate, no matter what the extremes tell us. Remember what is at stake: lives are being lost. We can’t be distracted because of a few loud voices.
We should require registration. We are required to register our cars and our dogs, but not our firearms? Is the fear of universal confiscation any more than a fringe argument, usually invoking Hitler?
Some arms and accessories don’t belong in private hands. The rapid-firing weapons and large clips used in many shootings don’t have a purpose that outweighs the risk. We already have a line here; let’s just redraw it with a bold marker.
Laws should be uniform. The argument that gun control laws do not work is not valid when someone can travel a few miles and find a different set of laws. And there are loopholes all over the place: at some gun shows, for example.
We need to make effective mental health care more available. The Newtown shooter had seen a therapist – it won’t prevent all fatalities – but it will help. It will help reduce all killings.
We need to be more effective as parents and/or adults. We need to lock up firearms and get more involved in children’s lives and decisions. We need to be more spiritual and less material.
We do not need to introduce guns everywhere as a deterrent or defense. More guns seem to promote more guns, no matter whose hands they’re in. And they don’t always stay in those hands.
We need to hold lawmakers accountable. In the last couple of years Congress has slipped amendments into unrelated bills that exempted dealers from verification of stolen guns, exempted veterans from certain background checks based on mental health, etc. We’ve seen politicians exploit the fear of guns to the extreme as well, alienating many who would accept rational measures. Lawmakers seem to be more accountable to campaign contributions and passionate blocs than to those they represent.
Consider that in the 2012 Aurora, CO massacre, for example, the shooter fired 30 rounds in under 30 seconds. 200 years ago a good shooter could maybe fire 30 rounds in an hour and a half. The men who adopted the Second Amendment had no knowledge of where we would be today, nor should we expect them to have been omniscient.
The Founding Fathers didn’t give everyone the right to vote, let slavery persist, never accounted for lawmakers acting in their own interest, etc. We have amended the Constitution and our thinking since then. Clinging to an unfettered right to ownership of all weapons shouldn’t stop us from working with this.
As a rural 1960s Minnesota boy with a crew cut, wearing a flannel shirt and Red Wing boots, I took a handgun to school. Another kid and I brought them for show-n-tell, waving them around in front of the class. It was not a big deal then, we just kept them in our coats the rest of the day. No one thought twice.
But times change, and we have to change. Can we really just let the carnage continue? There has to be a middle ground between a police state and a Wild West atmosphere.
Let’s not let the debate lose momentum, but let’s be civil, reasonable and respectful at the same time. Sift through the arguments and reject the distractions. A good share of 30,000 lives per year depends on it.
Comments:
2014
Neil Malm says:I agree and would like to see a rational debate on this issue.
Do you realize you are asking for rational reasonable debate, then urge everyone to hurry debate before the emotion fades about Sandy Point? You seem to be arguing both ways. I can kind of understand that though. It is hard not to be emotional. Personally, I am still livid and enraged about Sandy Point. How can we have let this happen again? Why haven't we put armed guards (visible and concealed) in our schools, businesses? It is insane.
One of the problems with Gun Control is. As terrible, tragic, and horror able as Sandy Point and other gun massacres are. We have to remember it takes Governments to really perfect Mass Murder. Stalin, Moa, Pol Pot, and yes Hilter massacred as many as 50 million between them all. Guns are our last line of defense against that happening. Our founding fathers had just fought a war with tremendous loss of life and property. They without a doubt understood how destructive guns can be. They had only to look at the advantage of guns over bows and arrows to see further proof.
I have to ask how much of the "Issue" is GUN Control though? To me this is as much about guns, as drunk driving is about cars. Both are involved but not the real cause. This is about Mental health, a culture of Violence, and drugs.
I did some research about Gun massacres and it seemed pretty clear these are mentally disturbed people. They are very angry. They plan their attacks and scout for the place to make their attack. And they go to where they think they can kill without someone stopping them. They bring a wide variety and multiple quantities of weapons obtained legally or illegally. They want to go out in a blaze of media hype and notoriety.
We have a culture of Violence. The FBI figures I found were through 2011. They show in 2011 the USA had 12,664 Murders. 8583 with guns, 1694 with Knifes cutting objects, 1163 from other ways, 728 with hands, 496 with Blunt objects. Britain with its gun bans had 551 murders. So with a comparable population they would have around 2725 non gun murders to Americas 4081 Non gun murders. This would seem to show America is far more Violent than Britain in general.
More gun have been sold in the last 4 years than the previous 7 years and yet crime and Murder are down for the last 4 years. This seems to destroy the idea GUNs are the problem.
So what do we do?
We put armed guards and concealed carry people in our schools and businesses so these people do not have an easy target for their rampages.
We have to study why these people are venting their rage this way.
We have to stop the culture of Violence that is pushed, encourage in America by Hollywood, TV, Music, Video games to name a few. It is about a News media that encourages copycats with their coverage of these attacks. I was totally outraged that Texas Chainsaw Massacre 3D came out shortly after Sandy Hook.
People want to ban a gun( assault rifles) because of how it looks. This to me is should set off alarms for these people. Why aren't we looking at what is promoting that look that as a weapon to be used to go on rampages with? Our Media in Hollywood? Large clip bans will be largely ineffective as many of these killers have carried 3-4 pistols with 10 round clips. That is 30-40 shots in the same time as one 30 round clip.
We have to look at the way Drugs factor into the violence in America. As much as 80-90% of crime is for, over, or under the influence of drugs.
These are the issues I believe we have to address in this country TODAY if we are to stop these attacks.
Do you realize you are asking for rational reasonable debate, then urge everyone to hurry debate before the emotion fades about Sandy Point? You seem to be arguing both ways. I can kind of understand that though. It is hard not to be emotional. Personally, I am still livid and enraged about Sandy Point. How can we have let this happen again? Why haven't we put armed guards (visible and concealed) in our schools, businesses? It is insane.
One of the problems with Gun Control is. As terrible, tragic, and horror able as Sandy Point and other gun massacres are. We have to remember it takes Governments to really perfect Mass Murder. Stalin, Moa, Pol Pot, and yes Hilter massacred as many as 50 million between them all. Guns are our last line of defense against that happening. Our founding fathers had just fought a war with tremendous loss of life and property. They without a doubt understood how destructive guns can be. They had only to look at the advantage of guns over bows and arrows to see further proof.
I have to ask how much of the "Issue" is GUN Control though? To me this is as much about guns, as drunk driving is about cars. Both are involved but not the real cause. This is about Mental health, a culture of Violence, and drugs.
I did some research about Gun massacres and it seemed pretty clear these are mentally disturbed people. They are very angry. They plan their attacks and scout for the place to make their attack. And they go to where they think they can kill without someone stopping them. They bring a wide variety and multiple quantities of weapons obtained legally or illegally. They want to go out in a blaze of media hype and notoriety.
We have a culture of Violence. The FBI figures I found were through 2011. They show in 2011 the USA had 12,664 Murders. 8583 with guns, 1694 with Knifes cutting objects, 1163 from other ways, 728 with hands, 496 with Blunt objects. Britain with its gun bans had 551 murders. So with a comparable population they would have around 2725 non gun murders to Americas 4081 Non gun murders. This would seem to show America is far more Violent than Britain in general.
More gun have been sold in the last 4 years than the previous 7 years and yet crime and Murder are down for the last 4 years. This seems to destroy the idea GUNs are the problem.
So what do we do?
We put armed guards and concealed carry people in our schools and businesses so these people do not have an easy target for their rampages.
We have to study why these people are venting their rage this way.
We have to stop the culture of Violence that is pushed, encourage in America by Hollywood, TV, Music, Video games to name a few. It is about a News media that encourages copycats with their coverage of these attacks. I was totally outraged that Texas Chainsaw Massacre 3D came out shortly after Sandy Hook.
People want to ban a gun( assault rifles) because of how it looks. This to me is should set off alarms for these people. Why aren't we looking at what is promoting that look that as a weapon to be used to go on rampages with? Our Media in Hollywood? Large clip bans will be largely ineffective as many of these killers have carried 3-4 pistols with 10 round clips. That is 30-40 shots in the same time as one 30 round clip.
We have to look at the way Drugs factor into the violence in America. As much as 80-90% of crime is for, over, or under the influence of drugs.
These are the issues I believe we have to address in this country TODAY if we are to stop these attacks.









1759
11:40:40, Jan 23rd 2013
Fletch says:With over 2000 gun laws on the books, how can people honestly believe that more regulation is the answer?
Statistics from around the world prove that banning and trying to regulate gun ownership not only leads to more violent crimes and murder, but also opens the door wide for government tyranny. And despite your comment regarding Hitler, you need not look that far into history. North Korea comes to mind immediately.
Thank you.